I had (still do; that's why I'm posting) some issues with a worship service several weeks ago at VOP.
Towards the end of service, Anita called the prophetic team up to the front and several minutes were spent passing the mic from person to person as they communicated words or impressions they had received from the Spirit about specific people in the congregation.
Before I go into why this event left me quite unsettled, a couple disclaimers. First, I affirm the gift of prophecy--its existence and rightful purpose as a means for God to communicate with His followers. Second, to the person who was told of his God-given spirit of boldness and God's delight in it, the following is not meant to be a knock on the word given you that morning, or an expression of my doubt in its validity. Subsequent conversations you and I have had show me that the prophecy you received was right on and timely. Praise God for the good word that morning, and for how He's molding you and preparing you now.
The prophesying bothered me because of a combination of two things: that it was personal and that it was public. Contrast this with how it's usually done in service--a pastor will announce non-specifically that words have been received for x, y, and z (public, but not personal) and the congregants are invited forward for prayer if they feel led, whereupon they may get further words from a prayer team member (personal, but not public). I don't have a problem with this, I think it's great ministry time. So why do I think it was inappropriate for it to be both personal and public?
Most of what was spoken that morning was the warm 'n' fuzzy type, lots of great encouragement, affirmation of God's love for people, etc. But what if a prophetic word is received that isn't so happy? Perhaps a couple is struggling in their marriage, or a young man is grappling with an addiction. Should those things be aired in front of the congregation? Should people be called out on things like that? Does it edify the rest of the body to know the skeletons in each other's closets? I'm not convinced that would be an effective way of drawing people closer to the person and character of Christ. Transparency and a recognition of/dealing with sin certainly are callings of the Church, but I would argue that the public forum is not always the appropriate place for them to be exercised. This is all hypothetical extrapolation (is that redundant?), but the precedent of doing personal+public prophesying begs the question of just how far it could be taken. And the extent it could be taken troubles me.
The public forum also restricts the possibility of dialogue about the prophetic message between deliverer and deliveree. To me, having the prophesy spoken during the corporate worship service imparts (truly or not) a certain authority on it. It's like it's received the God-Seal-of-Approval (TM). How can one argue with the official word given during the sanctity of a worship service, the high point of a Christian's week as far as doing "God-stuff" goes? If the prophetic word catches me by surprise because it doesn't seem to relate to anything I'm conscious of in my life, how can I say, "Wait, I don't think so because..." without standing against the authority of the worship setting and the witness of the entire congregation? Despite all the best intentions, training, and prayer, we are and will always be fallible creations, both in delivering God's message and receiving it. Therefore the opportunity must be provided to flesh out God's revelation to us, to work through it together, to check it against Scripture and the widsom of others. The unidirectional delivery of a prophetic word during a worship service does not allow for this.
[An aside: I suspect that my views of the special-ness of a Sunday morning service aren't shared by all, and I'll admit that my high-church background is rearing its sacramental head here, but that can be the subject of another post.]
Related to fallibility, although I trust the word of God (ok, that's easy to say, not easy to do), I'm not sure I would trust it coming through the mouth of a virtual stranger. I don't mean that in a negative way against the prophetic team, I'm sure they're all lovely people, but my point is that I think we all want to have a relationship with someone before we allow them to speak into our lives. We trust the counsel of our friends and mentors because they in fact have earned our trust. Some of the prophetic words given that morning were spoken to individuals the speaker did not know. So should a "prophesy" trump our innate desire to know someone well before we let them communicate God's word to us? I'm not sure it does. To take a verse horribly out of context, "Jesus I know, and Paul I've heard of, but who are you?"
Lastly, Anita introduced the time as a "demonstration" of God's power or presence or work here and now. It might be just semantics or a word choice that didn't carry as much significance to her, but I don't think we need to "demonstrate" God, least of all to a body of believers. God doesn't need to be paraded around, or reduced to a parlor trick. We do ministry as an act of worship, not as a means to convince others of who God is or what He can do. God does the convincing. He can demonstrate His own power. We are not Elijah confronting the prophets of Baal. The audience of a demonstration is the observers, but in doing ministry, our audience should always be God.
I will be in church on Sunday. There are thises and thats about how the Vineyard does church that challenge me and stretch me. I don't agree with everything. But those are non-essentials and I do believe that God is doing Good Things there.
Thanks for reading. Love and grace to you all.
Towards the end of service, Anita called the prophetic team up to the front and several minutes were spent passing the mic from person to person as they communicated words or impressions they had received from the Spirit about specific people in the congregation.
Before I go into why this event left me quite unsettled, a couple disclaimers. First, I affirm the gift of prophecy--its existence and rightful purpose as a means for God to communicate with His followers. Second, to the person who was told of his God-given spirit of boldness and God's delight in it, the following is not meant to be a knock on the word given you that morning, or an expression of my doubt in its validity. Subsequent conversations you and I have had show me that the prophecy you received was right on and timely. Praise God for the good word that morning, and for how He's molding you and preparing you now.
The prophesying bothered me because of a combination of two things: that it was personal and that it was public. Contrast this with how it's usually done in service--a pastor will announce non-specifically that words have been received for x, y, and z (public, but not personal) and the congregants are invited forward for prayer if they feel led, whereupon they may get further words from a prayer team member (personal, but not public). I don't have a problem with this, I think it's great ministry time. So why do I think it was inappropriate for it to be both personal and public?
Most of what was spoken that morning was the warm 'n' fuzzy type, lots of great encouragement, affirmation of God's love for people, etc. But what if a prophetic word is received that isn't so happy? Perhaps a couple is struggling in their marriage, or a young man is grappling with an addiction. Should those things be aired in front of the congregation? Should people be called out on things like that? Does it edify the rest of the body to know the skeletons in each other's closets? I'm not convinced that would be an effective way of drawing people closer to the person and character of Christ. Transparency and a recognition of/dealing with sin certainly are callings of the Church, but I would argue that the public forum is not always the appropriate place for them to be exercised. This is all hypothetical extrapolation (is that redundant?), but the precedent of doing personal+public prophesying begs the question of just how far it could be taken. And the extent it could be taken troubles me.
The public forum also restricts the possibility of dialogue about the prophetic message between deliverer and deliveree. To me, having the prophesy spoken during the corporate worship service imparts (truly or not) a certain authority on it. It's like it's received the God-Seal-of-Approval (TM). How can one argue with the official word given during the sanctity of a worship service, the high point of a Christian's week as far as doing "God-stuff" goes? If the prophetic word catches me by surprise because it doesn't seem to relate to anything I'm conscious of in my life, how can I say, "Wait, I don't think so because..." without standing against the authority of the worship setting and the witness of the entire congregation? Despite all the best intentions, training, and prayer, we are and will always be fallible creations, both in delivering God's message and receiving it. Therefore the opportunity must be provided to flesh out God's revelation to us, to work through it together, to check it against Scripture and the widsom of others. The unidirectional delivery of a prophetic word during a worship service does not allow for this.
[An aside: I suspect that my views of the special-ness of a Sunday morning service aren't shared by all, and I'll admit that my high-church background is rearing its sacramental head here, but that can be the subject of another post.]
Related to fallibility, although I trust the word of God (ok, that's easy to say, not easy to do), I'm not sure I would trust it coming through the mouth of a virtual stranger. I don't mean that in a negative way against the prophetic team, I'm sure they're all lovely people, but my point is that I think we all want to have a relationship with someone before we allow them to speak into our lives. We trust the counsel of our friends and mentors because they in fact have earned our trust. Some of the prophetic words given that morning were spoken to individuals the speaker did not know. So should a "prophesy" trump our innate desire to know someone well before we let them communicate God's word to us? I'm not sure it does. To take a verse horribly out of context, "Jesus I know, and Paul I've heard of, but who are you?"
Lastly, Anita introduced the time as a "demonstration" of God's power or presence or work here and now. It might be just semantics or a word choice that didn't carry as much significance to her, but I don't think we need to "demonstrate" God, least of all to a body of believers. God doesn't need to be paraded around, or reduced to a parlor trick. We do ministry as an act of worship, not as a means to convince others of who God is or what He can do. God does the convincing. He can demonstrate His own power. We are not Elijah confronting the prophets of Baal. The audience of a demonstration is the observers, but in doing ministry, our audience should always be God.
I will be in church on Sunday. There are thises and thats about how the Vineyard does church that challenge me and stretch me. I don't agree with everything. But those are non-essentials and I do believe that God is doing Good Things there.
Thanks for reading. Love and grace to you all.
posted by Anonymous at
5:59 PM
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